There are lot of people in the privacy communities who are shaming and attacking those of us who want take take privacy seriously. more than just using firefox and a vpn. So many people are trying to influence the privacy community to not use whonix or tor browser. That it’s paranoid and extreme to leave your phone at home. And so on.
They keep pushing this propaganda without even knowing what they are talking about. They will keep spamming everywhere that you don’t need to protect your firmware from physical access adversaries because the only adversaries who can do something like that are feds and feds will never target you unless you are a cartel leader or running a darknet market or something very terrible.
But these same people who spread this propaganda can’t even tell you what the difference is between bios and uefi. Which means they have no idea what they are talking about and are just spreading propaganda/disinformation.
Why would they do that? They are probably american feds. We all know there is lots of evidence of feds like fbi,nsa,cia corruption and they all hate privacy and keep spamming their propaganda about if you have nothing to hide then you don’t need privacy. With that in mind it’s obvious that they are doing at least some sort of propaganda/influence campaigns to slow down, derail, end privacy activism.
We also know it doesn’t take much to become a terrorist. UK gov has officially publicly announced that anyone on X who retweets an ongoing protest is a terrorist and they will be arrested. Elon musk is officially a terrorist and the uk gov has repeatedly asked usa to hand him over. So it’s very easy to become targeted by feds, you dont have to do anything bad, just use freedom of speech.
And in france it was many times in the news about a group of friends who were arrested for using Signal. A girl they tried to convince to start using signal called the police and said they are using anonymous communication called Signal and then they were arrested and all their computers taken and forensics went through all the data on their computer and judge said its criminal evidence they have ad blockers on their browser.
It’s an infinite list of evidence about how tyrannical the feds are and it doesn’t take anything to become targeted by them, just bad luck.
Imagine if you are traveling and go to a hostel and tell the people you’re staying there together with that your computer is off limits, no touching it and you will know because you have lots of security to detect tampering. If they start gossiping about this and then call the police you will probably have your computer confiscated and then forensics will go through it. Or maybe they’ll send an undercover hacker to try some covert physical access attacks.
And this is just talking about feds being adversary. There are also criminals that are hackers. And feds can be criminals too, like the high ranking cia officer who recently traveled south america and drugged and raped dozens of women before he was finally caught.
This all leads to my suggestion. I think we need to stop the feds influence and propaganda campaigns against the privacy communities. Stop shaming and attacking people for wanting more privacy than you. We need to start banning these people. Are there any privacy communities remaining where you can say you’re using tor browser without getting attacked for being an “extremist” and paranoid just because you use tor browser or leaving phone at home?
I’m happy there are so many that agree with me. Remember to not get stuck in the details but it’s about the bigger picture I’m saying here. To the few who are questioning the little stories I said and asking for sources: I didn’t think it was necessary, i honestly believed most here would have heard of it. Of course you won’t find an “official” source because of all the corrupt censorship the governments are doing. That france story was a hot topic in all the privacy and tech communities when it was happening. I found discussions everywhere about it. If you can’t find any good sources for these stories then I maybe will have trouble finding it too, maybe it is gone because of censorship. And even if I do find it, then it will just give the feds more meta data about me because they are probably angry at me for making this post and want to find me and punish me for making this post. I bet half the downvotes are from feds.
K gov has officially publicly announced that anyone on X who retweets an ongoing protest is a terrorist and they will be arrested. Elon musk is officially a terrorist and the uk gov has repeatedly asked usa to hand him over.
And in france it was many times in the news about a group of friends who were arrested for using Signal. A girl they tried to convince to start using signal called the police and said they are using anonymous communication called Signal and then they were arrested and all their computers taken and forensics went through all the data on their computer and judge said its criminal evidence they have ad blockers on their browser.
Could you provide sources for these, I have never heard such a thing and can’t find anything resembling either story online.
There isn’t a source. It’s nonsense. Someone was arrested for encouraging violent rioters in the summer in English cities, and rightly so. It wasn’t a protest. It was violent, unruly behaviour by abhorrent thugs. This person sounds like someone who believes everything Elon Musk and Nigel Farage tells him.
How on earth does this reach a 75% approval rate?
I apologize for being rude, but these are bold claims with no sources whatsoever. I mean I can understand that it might be frustrating to be called paranoid over using Tor, and there certainly use cases or threat models where it makes sense to use Tor. But this post is either a full-on conspiracy theory or carefully crafted troll content.
It’s not an approval rating. It’s a rating of what percentage of users find the post and discussion worthy of attention.
That’s a good point.
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This post is absolute fucking nonsense. Mods, plz?
I do not mean to sound rude, but this reads like a paranoid conspiracy theorist’s diary entry.
There are lot of people in the privacy communities who are shaming and attacking those of us who want take take privacy seriously.
Okay, and there are a lot of people who aren’t doing those things and are either supportive or neutral on your choices. The internet is full of people with opinions. I suggest blocking the people you don’t like.
And in france it was many times in the news about a group of friends who were arrested for using Signal.
Citation needed. Your third- or fourth-hand account is so vague that I wonder if the devil has been lost along with the details.
This all leads to my suggestion. I think we need to stop the feds influence and propaganda campaigns against the privacy communities.
You haven’t demonstrated that this is happening. It probably is to some degree, but you haven’t given any kind of diagnostic evidence that anyone could use to detect a “fed” over an earnest human being with a shit opinion. How would you make that determination? What if I earnestly disagree with someone using Tor, because my foundation of information is based on a lie? Do I deserve to be banned, or should I be educated?
Ultimately, I don’t know why you care what other people think. If they think you’re some weird degenerate for using Tor and leaving your phone at home, that’s their problem. If you ask people not to use your computer, and they think you’re a degenerate because of it, that’s their problem.
By all means, take your privacy seriously and do what makes you feel safe, but that doesn’t mean there’s bad actors lurking in every shadow. Your desire for privacy should not lead you to paranoia.
Here is the story OP might be thinking of https://www.laquadrature.net/en/2023/10/06/the-beginning-of-the-8-december-trial-is-also-the-judgement-of-the-right-to-privacy-and-encryption/
So nobody was arrested for using signal, however it was considered as incriminating evidence during the trial that they protected their privacy and didnt want to give their im encryption keys to law enforcement
And in france it was many times in the news about a group of friends who were arrested for using Signal.Citation needed. Your third- or fourth-hand account is so vague that I wonder if the devil has been lost along with the details.
It piqued my curiosity. The only references I could find were the Telegram CEO being arrested earlier this year (widely reported on) and a group arrested in 2023 for associating with a Kurdish militant faction (YPG). That incident had some misdirected media attention towards the encryption tools used.
Yeah, my problem with later retellings of stories like OP’s is I have no way to verify if they’ve missed the plot or some pertinent details that might point to a legitimate reason they would be arrested. “They used Signal” is hardly incriminating on its own, and OP strikes me as paranoid and not especially skeptical.
I’m happy to be wrong, but I can’t just take OP’s word that their recounting is accurate. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
I do remember a story a while ago about such French people… But those were previously involved in protests or planning thereof, in which case scrutiny is very expected regardless of what tools they’d use.
Are there any privacy communities remaining where you can say you’re using tor browser without getting attacked for being an “extremist” and paranoid just because you use tor browser or leaving phone at home?
I say this half jokingly, but after reading the rest of your post and a couple samples from your post history, I can tell you that “using the tor browser” and “leaving phone at home” is probably not why people call you paranoid.
Why would they do that? They are probably american feds.
Maybe, but I can think of another possibility:
There is a certain personality type that loves to feel like an authority in whatever community they frequent, and will jump at the chance to criticize someone whose concerns, experiences, or approach to solving a problem differs from their own. It has been very common in tech support forums for ages, and I think it’s becoming common in privacy forums as the topic becomes important to more people.
So, while it’s possible that some of what you are describing comes from government agency-sponsored influence campaigns (this would not surprise me), I strongly suspect that at least some of it is just mundane egotism. There are a lot of jerks on the internet. Many of them even believe they’re being helpful.
Whatever the reason for it, I agree with you: Those people should be told to knock it off, and if they don’t, then they should be shown to the door.
As a relative newcomer to the privacy community, I don’t remember constantly hearing about things being overreacting. What I do remember hearing is to think about your threat model and behaving accordingly, to not over-sacrifice convenience for things that aren’t a priority to you.
Is this concern trolling?
WHAT?? People getting arrested for having an ad blocker and using signal? That’s just insane that’s not even “over the top” privacy they aren’t even using tor.
The first thing is knowing that it exists. I am downvoted all the time for suggesting the use of Monero as private currency.
leaving your phone at home is extreme?? wtf.
i agree w most of this. how do you expect to help convince others that privacy is important in this day & age if you’re being a turd bc you feel superior to someone that is just starting out? being civil & helpful doesn’t cost anything. i guess being toxic doesn’t either but that won’t help anyone move fwd to a better place of privacy.
how easily we forget about our beginnings in the privacy realm.
10/10 and notice all the nitpicking of one irrelevant detail. That’s a credibility attack. The main thrust of the argument is 100%. It was just something personal that stuck out to the author. If that related Signal experience isn’t true there are thousands more that are.
10/10 especially for the physical security mention. So-called Cybersecurity “Wisdom” will tell you that physical access means game over and that YOU DO NOT NEED TO PROTECT AGAINST IT. It’s a cohencidence that that group that tells that lie benefits the most from the telling of it.
I do agree :) Just think about those wonderful NIST curves specially crafted to snoop on all communication. If this doesn’t makes you extremist and “paranoid” then nothing does…
And in france it was many times in the news about a group of friends who were arrested for using Signal. […]
I never heard of such a story. Do you have any reputable source to backup your claims?
Feds don’t care because they can’t profit off of your privacy. I would expect Russian/Chinese citizens are influenced by CIA employees to not use privacy.
Just like China and Russia have paid hackers and would therefore encourage US users to not use security.
