I tried last week. Bunch of stuff in my system didn’t work out of the gate, trying to use fixes that were meant for slightly different hardware/distro combos broke it further. Ultimately it became trying to start over or going back to the default Windows install.
So anyway, I’m using Windows on that machine now. How’s your week been?
At least you tried! And annoying that you stumbled upon hw issues.
If you ever want to try again what about getting hold of an old drive, or try dual boot, then you can swap back to windows easily and there’s less pressure for Linux to work out of the box.
As you say the guides you used didn’t match, try and research more about what is the correct distro for you, and maybe start with one that looks like a sure bet.
Guys, seriously, I know how to do this. I’ve installed Linux on random PCs for decades. It’s not my first rodeo.
Once you turn the century it starts to get annoying when people’s default stance to legit compatibility issues becomes to affect condescending patience at you. I knew how to set up a dual boot (I chose not to, instead directly booting from an external drive, which works just fine and allows you to revert by just yanking it out), I knew how to find support (the guides don’t match because the laptop family I was using needs specific libraries and kernel modifications and my model is relatively rare so the tutorials aren’t meant for it specifically).
I swear, the Linux community, such as it is, thinks that everybody backing off is some technically illiterate rando and mostly scared of UX differences and typing terminal commands. That’s really not the case. All available Linux DEs are extremely easy to parse for both Windows and MacOs users, being able to copy/paste text to take semi-complex actions instead of digging through the visual interface saves some time and the total normies that could use this type of feedback aren’t trying to do this in the first place. It’s fine.
I’ll try again next time I have a disposable computer that has some specific plug-and-play distro ready to go. Maybe. If I feel like it. And if I need tech help with it, I’ll gladly ask. For now, though, this particular machine is back to Windows because the troubleshooting is more of a hassle than the transition is an improvement. That’s the beginning and the end of this conversation, really.
No problem, it just sounded like you needed help.
To avoid getting advice then you better mark your comment, with rant or something.
People who are mad at the “Linux community” amuse me. It just makes you sound like a baby.
I mean, call it what you want, that’s why I qualified it in the first place.
I’m not mad at them, but it’s been long enough that I do find it frustrating that you can’t share any degree of a technical problem or UX issue without having a bunch of people crawl from under every rock to share with you the same three pieces of Linux 101 advice.
Your problem is that people want to help you “wrong”. That’s my point exactly.
Nah, I don’t have a problem at all. That’s my point. I never asked for help and got a bunch of condescending, inapplicable, very basic advice regardless.
You sounded angry and childish to me. /Shrug
You could’ve just said “I’m knowledgeable and have tried those things” but instead you wrote a tirade against the whole community
You still have Windows? Well there’s your problem, you’re supposed to format the entire drive when installing Linux…
Oh, that was absolutely not my problem. The “crashing whenever it was put to sleep” part was my problem. The distro I tried was pretty good about wiping and repartitioning the drive I gave it without messing with anything else, actually. Gotta give it to Linux devs, at least at this point they fully acknowledge that “just checking this out to see if I like it” is a major use case.
Disk partioning has been around since the 60s, it’s not really a new feature to be able to install a distro without wiping the whole drive and has nothing to do with Linux.
I’m… not impressed with the concept of disk partitioning, what a weird way to read that.
I’m impressed with the interface smartly picking up on what you’re trying to do, shrinking and growing partitions and setting up things automatically to specifically support a non-destructive install to coexist with other OSs because the idea that you’d be just testing a distro alongside Windows or something else is a specifically supported use case.
Windows runs my laptop harder, uses more battery and the fans are spinning a lot of times whist it runs almost silent in Linux. I’ve settled on EndeavourOS which has given me a headache-free experience for my hardware (lenovo yoga pro 7 7840hs). Only keep widows for BIOS updates otherwise I’d have nuked that hodge podge of software melange.
If you’re really set on windows you could try tiny11 to remove most of the bloat.
the fans are spinning a lot of times whist it runs almost silent in Linux
In my experience that is because Linux (or whatever part of it that’s responsible) will only start cooling if it absolutely has to. Otherwise it’s happy to cook my laptop at 92°C.
I’ve just finished reinstalling mint after applying a fix that was supposed to let me control the fans fucked up xOrg beyond repair. Multi-monitor setup is broken. On Ubuntu I couldn’t even get the Wifi to work. Manjaro refused to update packages because after installing a usual 300+ package update surge, suddenly everything was in conflict with each other. On all distros I needed to edit a config file so external speakers wouldn’t hum at full volume when no sound was playing.
Even with the supposedly ‘easy’ distros, Linux still isn’t an everyman’s operating system.
I had issues with Manjaro and WiFi disconnecting. Also, Manjaro dropped hardware acceleration for video codecs. Eventually got too annoyed to deal with the Manjaro direction and moved to EOS. Everything is working fine barring a script to get the headphones volume to work (recognised as bass speaker in alsa paths). So far, EOS has been the set and forget type of OS for me.
Linux seems to be really weird like that. I run it on every computer I can get my hands on, from an old netbook to a modern convertible, to a gaming PC with Nvidia graphics, and haven’t had any major issues with any distro I tried (I tried all the independent ones, not a fan of derivatives).
But on the other hand, some people seem to run into ALL the issues.
Beats me.
Yeah, no, not doing that either.
I mean, yeah, Linux ran leaner and felt a bit snappier in the OS and in like-for-like loads on Firefox, but the difference is a few dB, I can certainly live with it.
I’m not “set” on anything here, if I hadn’t had issues with compatibility I would have stuck with Linux on it. I really, really don’t mind either for most tasks.
What distro did you use? and what gpu?
Nope, we’re not doing this.
I used distro “ShouldWork” and GPU “ShouldBeSupported”. And given that it didn’t work and wasn’t supported, I didn’t keep troubleshooting it, because I already have a OS install that works and requires no troubleshooting.
I would love a one click install for each of my specific devices that is reliable out of the box, but that’s not the world we live in, so in this timeline that computer is back to Windows now.
Because I know that nvidia is not really good on linux, you can try using pop os because they have pre-installed nvidia drivers
Seriously, you guys need to stop trying to troubleshoot Linux’s shortcomings at people. I know. Everybody knows. If you don’t, that’s the first thing any tutorial will tell you. I’m not looking for technical help, just sharing an anecdote.
If you’re curious, no, I couldn’t do Pop because I needed some specific libraries and kernel modules to support this particular device’s power management and I/O quirks and those were only officially supported in a handful of distros, so I picked one of the ones with better documentation, and even that wasn’t meant for my specific hardware.
Not that it matters, because it’s a laptop with a iGPU and a dGPU, and the Intel iGPU was just fine out of the box, so getting the Nvidia dGPU to work well was way down my priority list for this exercise, since the device was meant mostly for web browsing and media consumption. Instead, I had issues with sleep mode, since that was related to those specific modifications, and I coudn’t figure out a way to make it wake from boot without locking up, which is a pretty big dealbreaker for a device on a battery. Plus the embedded audio controls had some issues, the touchpad was flaky and eventually trying to go through the process of getting that dGPU running exposed other compatibility troubles.
I was ready to roll back to Windows once I noticed the touchpad acceleration was messy out of the gate, honestly, that’s my bar for troubleshooting tolerance. So no, I didn’t fail to do a cursory Google search in 2020 and find out that Nvidia support is messy. I knew that my slightly nonstandard device was going to be a bit of a challenge, but was hoping to get lucky. Didn’t get lucky and went back to what works on it. It’s not a call for help, it’s just a thing that happened last time I tried to switch a device to Linux.
Something doesn’t add up. My guess is you’re using a MacBook but don’t want to tell us for obvious reasons.
There’s literally no reason for “specific libraries and kernel modules” when installing Linux on any x86 PC. It makes no sense.If they said that they went “back” to Windows, why would you assume a MacBook?
Hah. Nope. There’s a ton of custom features on hardware that need tweaking all over Windows laptops. There are entire forums dedicated to specific brands out there. None of this was much of a surprise, I had put off giving this a try because I had read about the hoops I’d have to jump through and been too lazy to try.
Huh. I’ve installed Linux on anything from an old 32bit netbook to a Fujitsu convertible that both had such a fucked up UEFI implementation they couldn’t even boot a standard Windows ISO without Ventoy in grub mode, as well as a cobbled-together Workstation with Nvidia graphics, and never ran into issues like this.
What is this mysterious device that requires specific libraries and kernel modules? So I can state the fuck away from the device and the brand
obvious troll is obvious.
Believe what you want. I actually would like to move some (more) of my devices over. I’m just not so married to any one OS to try super hard. I just use whatever works.
It’s kinda nuts to me that not everybody is on the same page with that.
I laughed. This is the perfect response. Look at the triggered people!
Linux evangelists, man… They’re insufferable. I love Linux, but it’s not the only OS worth having in 2024. Like, I actually hate Apple but I still have a computer that boots it in my place. It’s okay to have lots of options!
Like I told the guy accusing me of trolling, I’m not even trying to “trigger” anyone, it’s just that people will walk you through the same three basic troubleshooting options whenever you point out you bumped into a compatibility issue and it gets annoying after a while.
Agreed on the other thing, though. I actively want Linux on desktop/laptop to be better. I actively like many things about it already, which is why I was trying to set it up on this thing in the first place. I use it on other devices that have specific support for it, from SBCs to the Steam Deck. And I definitely also have issues, concerns and pet peeves with Windows, Android variants, MacOS, iOS, iPadOS and every other alternative out there.
I just don’t particularly care to stick to a single thing and will use whatever the path of least resistance is for each application. Anything else seems nuts. An OS is a utility, not a sports team. It’s like rooting for an AC manufacturer.
Maybe that’s because of your extremely niche hardware vendor not providing appropriate drivers for their hardware?! Honestly, I read your salty comments under this post and your kind of attitude really pisses me off. Don’t like the experience? Totally fine, don’t use Linux and move on. Linux, for the most part, is FOSS software so feel free to contribute to it instead of complaining about things being broken. Linux is also free in terms of cost. So quite frankly, the developers of your distribution of choice owe you nothing.
But I do like Linux. That’s a really silly thing to say. That’s why I was trying to get it in there even though I knew the support wasn’t all sorted. Screw that “if you don’t like it, leave” attitude.
And no, I won’t contribute to fixing the issues because I lack the technical skills to do so and the skills I can contribute they don’t need. That’s also silly, you can’t be arguing for mainstream adoption of a thing and simultaneously saying users should be out there fixing it themselves if they encounter an unaddressed hardware incompatibility.
And yes, it’s absolutely down to the manufacturer not making a Linux version of their drivers and dumb dedicated software. Absolutely. What am I supposed to do about that? It’s not a niche manufacturer, either, it’s a pretty popular one. As far as I know, none of the big corporate laptop manufacturers offer official Linux support (at least not Lenovo, Asus, MSI or Dell, that I know of). In fact, the indie manufacturers tend to offer better support, what with using less custom hardware and software and sometimes offering a built-in Linux install as an option to serve as a workaround for OEM fees.
Look, if you don’t want to hear about the issues people encounter with your OS of choice… fine, I guess. I don’t know why you’re emotionally invested in utilitarian pieces of software, but you do you. But if you hope that you’re going to be online having a fanclub about an operating system, of all things, and nobody is ever gonna show up saying “hey, I tried it and it kinda didn’t do it for me”… eh… maybe make it a private Discord channel instead, because that’s probably not gonna happen otherwise. That’s probably a reason why you don’t get Windows or MacOS fanclubs out there, because let me be clear, I would have just as many objections to dump into those, albeit for different reasons.
Boys, I tried. But I couldn’t get HDR working properly in KDE, the kernel kept randomly locking up to the point where even REISUB didn’t do anything, and 95% of my GPU settings were missing from the Nvidia X Server app and I couldn’t get most of them restored.
Linux users look at me like I’m insane when I ask where the RTX Video Enhancement and 3D settings are. Half the reason why I bought an RTX GPU was for the video enhancement features like SDR to HDR conversion and AI upscaling, yet these features simply don’t exist in Linux. And when it comes to the 3D settings, “just change the graphics settings in-game”, I’ve seen people say, failing to realize that the vast majority of games are missing several graphics settings that are in the 3D settings screen. I go into that menu and make tweaks before I play anything. It’s a make-or-break feature for me.
I’m sorry but Linux still hasn’t caught up enough with Windows yet in the gaming and HDR realm for me to commit to an OS change. But if you have an AMD GPU and don’t have an HDR display, I’m sure it’s a wonderful gaming experience for you. I’ll check back again in another 5 years.
You’re absolutely right that Linux is still missing a lot of the features that are available on Windows. But the freedom you get with it is so worth it for me, even if my 4090 is bored most of the time.
I just wish Linux partisans would acknowledge that Linux has serious shortcomings rather than constantly shouting about how there is literally no reason to ever use Windows.
I greatly prefer Linux for tasks like software development, but when I sit down to pay a game, I don’t want to have to debug it first.
To be fair, if you do not care about the newest iteration of whatever Nvidia is up to (Frame Generation, RTX HDR, etc.) and don’t play games with kernel-level anti-cheat systems, there are really no issues with gaming on Linux these days - at least in my experience.
Same here. Occasionally I need to play around with wine/proton but it works.
It has no shortcomings if you have infinite time to write your own patches first. That’s something you can’t legally do on windows.
Theoretically almost all shortcomings can be overcome apart from the time you spend.
Realistically there are a few shortcomings but for me they are barely noticeable and the customisability and package managers more than make up for any troubles I personally run into. And it’s foss.
I only recommend Linux to people who are in similar situations to me. Unfortunately most people I know use some windows only games or share the device with others and are scared of messing up the installation.
I mostly jokingly recommend it whenever someone complains about Microsoft messing something up for them, encountering a problem and not finding out why it’s happening.
Currently supported feature sets on Linux cover 90% of the general computer using population’s requirements. Linux has shortcomings on features that most people don’t even have access to based on their existing hardware.
Of course Linux has shortcomings.
But compared to Windows, it’s still the vastly better OS regarding compatibility, UI, UX, user friendliness and overall functionality. At least for me and my use cases (I use it for browsing, gaming, office, photo editing and as a streaming station).
You’re mileage may vary.Yes exactly! Linux has its pitfalls, but the pitfalls of Linux are far more tolerable for me than the shortcomings of windows.
Macs I can’t speak for because I’ve never tried, but they seem overpriced
I’m in the same boat as you. I really wanted to switch. I had Ubuntu 20.04 installed on a partition from a previous attempt to convert. Installed all the software I needed, mapped my NAS, and then hit a huge roadblock when trying to connect my laser cutter.
Found plenty of support pages that all agree on possible issues related to either drivers or dial out access, but nothing worked. I researched and tried everything I found. So many USB drivers, a few different driver and package utilities and even drivers from repositories I came across on some Chinese websites that I had to translate and appeared to be related.
I got to a point that I thought a clean install might help. Uninstalled Ubuntu 20.04, installed Mint, tried everything again, uninstalled Mint, and finally installed Ubuntu 22.04. I spent 3 full days pushing back projects trying to communicate with my laser, but finally got to the point that I was going to miss deadlines if I didn’t start running projects.
Booted up Windows and had no issues connecting and running. I was even able to drag in a second windows laptop that had never been used with the laser before, and it just worked immediately.
I wish I could make the jump from Windows.
I think most Linux users (including me) are just cheap and don’t even have hdr. One of my two monitors has a dent in frame and has one DVI port and power. I think a lot of the maintainers are similar and therefore don’t prioritise problems they don’t have yet.
I think it’s a real shame how bad the Nvidia experience can be but at this point I’ve found that if the drivers from the arch repos don’t work nicely the flatpak ones usually will. Wayland is of course still a problem for now but hopefully not for long.
deleted by creator
Not that the HDMI forum would allow that in oss at all… But I get the point. Honestly though if the stuttering goes away on Wayland I personally won’t have any more issues.
Half the reason why I bought an RTX GPU was for the video enhancement features like SDR to HDR conversion and AI upscaling
Neither of those things have anything to do with raytracing. Well the tensor cores used for denoising in RT workloads are suitable for all kinds of AI workloads and thus also upscaling, but really it hasn’t got to do anything with raytracing. Or AI in particular any GPU can do convolutions.
I don’t own an nvidia card and honestly few linux users do because their driver support sucks, I’d say if nvidia advertised those features and their linux drivers don’t have them your complaints should be directed at nvidia. They won’t care.
Meanwhile, mpv does inverse tone mapping natively. They don’t integrate AI upscaling but there’s various projects providing glsl shaders which mpv can use, here’s the configs for Anime4K. There’s also frame interpolation around somewhere but I haven’t used it in ages because variable refresh rate is the best solution to odd frame rates.
Development of X halted, the few patches that are still landing concern xwayland, don’t expect anything to happen there. KDE 6.0 ships with experimental HDR support on wayland, you might not need to wait five years go give a live USB stick a spin. Arch wiki has some pointers (not that I’d be recommending arch but I am recommending their wiki).
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Let’s wait for the next version of Windows, which will be distributed exclusively by paid subscription. Do you think Microsoft won’t find a way to hard-cut Windows 10 and 11? We are living in an era of another economic crisis. So I’ll meet you when you’ve learned the zen of the acronym RTFM.
RTFM
The battlecry of everyone that bitches that people aren’t willing to use Linux but won’t bother to meet them where they are.
Does it ever occur to you that people often don’t even know what they need to Google? Half the time I do Google something, it comes to some forum or Reddit post of someone screaming READ THE FUCKING MANUAL, but not even giving that user some hint what they’re even looking for in your religious scriptures.
You want people to use Linux? You need to meet them where they are, not take it as an opportunity to show how
smartmuch of a smartass you are.Be better than that.
Maybe a social interaction manual would be an idea.
I honestly try my best to be helpful in most cases but if were something related to a specific program I would suggest reading the manual because otherwise I’ll be the one doing it for them. If necessary I’ll show them where to find the manual and how I normally look through it.
Honestly, yeah. I get that social interaction is awkward for some people. I myself have Asperger’s (shut the fuck up, Cartman, I see your pudgy ass back there fidna pipe up), and I’ve never found people easy to understand. I think there really needs to be an initiative to teach people, normal people, how to use this stuff, and it doesn’t start by being an asshole. It starts by giving a shit and answering questions if you know the answers, or by helping people understand what might be going wrong. Even a word or two is helpful for beginning a Google search, but you have to know what you’re looking for in order to start looking for it.
What?
Preach!
What fantasy world are you living in that you think the next version of windows will require a subcription? If you just think about that for 5 seconds, you would realise how wholly stupid that idea is, and that it’s too stupid even for Microsoft.
I’m trying a new approach. Since I won’t touch anything beyond W10, and W10 is getting officially phased out, I just informed people that I won’t provide tech support for W11 and beyond.
I mean, I literally can’t. I barely used W10, I just flat out am unable to provide tech support, you might get lucky and I’ll figure it out but that’s the best I’ve got.
I really, really hate this picture. Everything is wrong with it. The pleading eyes to what can only be assumed is the adult behind the camera makes it extra bad.
It’s from a french tv documentary : https://youtu.be/Bk0iLlNTmVc?si=xptTU3Ay1cpeN2O4&t=3651
Oh, well, if they’re French
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/Bk0iLlNTmVc?si=xptTU3Ay1cpeN2O4&t=3651
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
ha I already am (Android)
!i actually daily-drive fedora on my laptop!<
IT PUTS ON THE UNIX SOCKS
But I use Linux too. I use arch
You’re fine then. That’s like beating yourself.
Remember when that time traveler posted Gibby with a Stop Sign memes about Queen Elizabeth’s death but due to the nature of butterfly effects she lived another few years? Good times.
Remember that time we had a rock concert at area 51?
I wish I could. I’ve been trying with mint but it won’t boot into it except the first time. Then I had to keep formatting the usbs and one USB said it had 4 mb instead of the 32 gigs
Try to format the USB, it will solve the issue.
I’ve been doing that over and over. But as soon as I download the iso file it goes to 4 mb being free space. On the manager it shows there is more space
you sure that usb has 32gigs? might be scam one that says it has more space than it does (would also explain the boot problem maybe?) but you said it launched fine once so i’m not sure/a mint iso won’t fit on 4mbs? but reformatting should definitely “reset” the usb… . have you tried it with a different one?
I’ve tried it with two different usbs. Maybe I should try a different brand. I bought both from micro center. I think the boot problem might be from having to copy and change a text for something in the files. But I can’t do that with the small amount of space left
Sounds like you didn’t prepare the USB stick correctly. Just use Balena Etcher to do it.
I did. I followed several videos but it wouldn’t boot or I had to keep formating the usb
For me, The day of become a full Linux user is coming, now that steam os and all related projects are in a high speed .
I am so close. Been testing on a laptop, finally got room setup to run, then I noticed more than half my vr library is not there, including apps for QoL while streaming. It is coming, but I doubt it will be before win 10 EoL and that makes me sad
Hey if you can get my laptop to boot from a liveusb then by all means
I’m guessing it has legacy bios which then means you need a cd/floppy.
Back when it was relevant I would use Plop it would magically boot any machine to usb that wasn’t capable yet.
It’s probably under ten years old so I didn’t think of that. I assumed windows was making it more difficult somehow. Now to find a writable disc…
As it should be. Beat it into them until they understand how superior it is to every other kernel!
Obviously people won’t respond well to being forced into something unknown or intimidating.
However, if you had a way to get it in front of them, many normal PC users would be totally fine and even have a better experience. Just go with a well supported distro made for convenience and a windows-like desktop. I think ordinary Mint Cinnamon is the obvious choice to start with.
I had the most horrible experience trying to install it on an SSD, I’ll ramble about it in some sub-lemmy to vent out 😭
First of all, “Read This Fine Manual.” Secondly, I don’t want people to use Linux. I’m not advocating anyone to use Linux, your best happiness costs $139 and that amount is included in the price of the device. Third, it’s not for you to teach me good manners.
Wow, little girl saw the keyword “RTFM” and took offense…
Maybe you should read the manual on how to reply to a Lemmy comment
Please do it first.
