cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/18475086
I’m not against those who work for sex, but the idea to earn for a living doesn’t seem nice. IMO, sex should be for 2 people (or more for others who prefer polyamory) who wants to be intimate/romantic with each other. My point is money should not be the purpose.
I’ll just respond to your take:
The idea to earn for a living doesn’t seem nice.
For you it doesn’t. For others, mind your own business.
sex should be for 2 people (or more for others who prefer polyamory) who wants to be intimate/romantic with each other.
For you it should. For others, mind your own business.
money should not be the purpose.
For you it shouldn’t. For others, mind your own business.
If you have any desire at all to weigh in or or take a position on the consensual sex lives of other adults, you’re just revealing how little you respect the freedom and autonomy of other people. You’re just revealing your desire to control others.
I don’t approve of work.
I’m of the opinion that if you don’t want people performing sex work, you should be enacting measures to improve people’s quality of life to where that’s not their only option. The workers themselves should have legal protections and be permitted to perform their job like any other worker is.
I suspect some people would prefer that as a regulated option anyway, and they should be defended in their choice to do so. Sex work is work.
Moreover, if you don’t want people doing sex work, then you probably especially don’t want people to be forced into doing sex work. But that’s precisely what happens when you criminalize it: you make it so that the only way the demand can be satisfied is through a shady black market where trafficking is orders of magnitude more likely to take place, and you make it orders of magnitude more difficult for victims and witnesses to go to the authorities to report it.
Sex work is work.
The people that do it deserve respect, and all the social and legal protections that attach to any other kind of work.
Your own preferred attitude to sex isn’t the point.
But should it be work?
Should we really have a society where selling your body is an opportunity to make money.
For instance, it imply that some poor women are gonna take it regardless the consequence, just because it’s the best alternative to pay the bills.
I can barely tolerate the physical straining we put on some workers. Sex work’s consequences are unacceptable to me in that same sens, sometimes worse.
So sure, no matter your opinion we should respect them, and not incriminate them!
And of course not all sex work is the same… to be acceptable it just requires better conditions. It can’t be something you choose out of need.
selling your body
i hate that phrasing to describe sex work. no one is “selling their body”, as they are still in control of it. sex workers provide a service, same as a masseuse or hair stylist (except their service involves genitals) and it should be treated as such.
Otherwise one could argue that all (physical) labour is “selling your body”
It seems to me like joining the military is arguably more deserving of the phrase “selling your body”; you’re basically signing up to get injured or killed.
It is a high risk job along the lines of coal mining and such, since it will result in an increase in transmitted disease risk. It’s important to acknowledge that, but I am on the side of it being work. I just think we need strong protections in place and regulations to handle it akin to other dangerous jobs. Like, a sex work branch of OSHA.
I think the “body” in that expression is quite specifically referring to genitals, or the selling of your intimacy.
Because that’s what’s different from any other physical labour, the part of your body involved. That’s the specific problem of sex work no?
It’s not even an argument really, it’s the undeniable logical conclusion that trading your labor and/or time for compensation is work, period.
For instance, it imply that some poor women are gonna take it regardless the consequence, just because it’s the best alternative to pay the bills.
How is this principally different from a poor person taking any shitty job to pay the bills? Like garbage collector or similarly unpleasant/disrespected jobs. The system always forces poor people to settle for shitty jobs. Sex work is not the issue there, the system is.
it should be decriminalized and it shouldn’t be financially compulsory for the desperate
Absolutely because then we can start talking about protecting and helping the sex workers that need help, and give them a chance to work in a safe environment.
Sex worker have been a thing since at least when we invented writings and still going strong today.
Might be time to give sex workers the dignity and respect they deserve.
It seems like you answered the question “should it be legal”, not “do you approve of it”.
I could technically disapprove of something and still want it to be legalized, but you normally approve what you want to legalize.
But to be clear, I approve of sex workers because to me, it is a job like any other. But since we built society on puritan values, they get a bad reputation and a terrible work situation.
I could technically disapprove of something and still want it to be legalized, but you normally approve what you want to legalize
A very enlightened and humble attitude. I commend you.
At this point I’m thinking we should legalize prostitution and criminalize dating.
Dating these days is what prostitution would be if it was published by EA. They added gambling mechanics and season passes.
You do know you don’t need a dating app for dating, right?
Who said anything about apps?
I probably misunderstood you. What did you mean by “They added gambling mechanics and season passes.”?
Okay, let’s put it this way:
Head out to Nevada, walk into one of the brothels they got outside Las Vegas. “One sex act, please.” “That will be number of dollars.” “Here is that number of dollars.” “Here is your sex act, and your receipt.” “Thank you, have a nice day.”
Meanwhile, go wherever it is you think you can meet women. Avoid female coworkers. Meet a girl at a bar and she actually gives you her number, what’s the chance she ghosts you after 5 or 6 of the expensive dinner dates she demands you take her on?
I reiterate, dating is like prostitution as published by EA.
Losers of the world unite! All women must be trafficked!
People break their bodies doing other kinds of work and people don’t seem too upset about that.
Some sex work isn’t even very physically involved. Take some pictures in the shower. Video yourself rubbing one out. It’s not all walking a dark, rainy, street in your underwear.
All workers should be unionized. Or maybe be in a worked owned cooperative. Capitalism will ruin everything eventually.
Everyone should have access to health care and basic needs.
Laws should be written with input what those they would bind and those they affect. Do sex workers want certain requirements? What do medical professionals think is safest? Laws should not be written to appease the nervous stomach of uninvolved parties.
But this is all fired from the hip because I haven’t done any real research. My gut feel is that most arguments against it are inconsistent (eg: “it’s degrading! But nevermind the job where they literally clean shit off the floor”) or personal nonsense (eg: “it’s a sin! But I don’t care that your worldview doesn’t say so”)
IMO, sex should be for 2 people (or more for others who prefer polyamory) who wants to be intimate/romantic with each other. My point is money should not be the purpose.
This is your personal opinion and really doesn’t justify laws backing it. It’s not founded on anything. Also I’ve got bad news about how a lot of sex isn’t intimate nor romantic.
I can’t fathom any reluctance coming from the left with respect to unionizing and providing necessary health services to any worker. If people do need to resort to sex work to make a living, then what are they supposed to do when they get older? Do you have to do a “respectable” job just to have the right to …retire? I feel some arguments come from a cruel place.
We can do a lot better than the Nordic Model, by the way!
The “legalize everything” response to the ineffeciveness of crackdowns at eliminating the root cause of social problems - like drug abuse and prostitution - is just libertarianism.
So it’s no wonder a bunch of nerdy guys groomed on reddit would be defending this.
Actually the left’s arguments come from information from the pornographers involved with digital pyramid schemes that also launder human trafficking by people like Andrew Tate.
Nobody in this thread has even heard of the Nordic Model, which helps get women out of the trade without criminalizing their activities, instead going after pimps. Employing former prostitutes as social workers.
There’s no need to rehabilitate women who are just entertaining the prostitution pyramid schemes or in the top brackets (essentially participating as e-madams). It’s practically just sharing nudes for pocket change for 99% of those involved.
The real purpose it to set up a wider market for dubiously sourced videos from human traffickers/kidnappers like Andrew Tate with better monetization than video streaming sites. The people jerking off in the shower are just helping provide cover by moving their nude sharing and cosplay activities into a human trafficking monetization pyramid scheme.
The best money is in the most violent and degrading acts available online. People purchasing sex acts through these platforms do it because the manipulation itself is valuable to them. They enjoy forcing people to do very uncomfortable things I’d rather not describe.
I’m getting all of this from actual sociologists by the way, before I get accused of having the same taste! They do studies on the german prostitution forum posts where they complain about the girls having sore holes and broken backs like it’s the wrong sauce on a schnitzel sandwich they ordered. The disgusting behavior is all public and cataloged, but ignored by the sexually desperate men in this thread
Many of you are underselling the exploitative and degrading nature of prostitution by referencing the people drawn into pyramid schemes just sharing their nudes for pocket change
Sex work is a more respectable career than debt collector, or CEO.
Exactly. Perfect example of labor owning the means of production.
hey look reactionary content from .world! Shocked
Sex work is work.
Yep. There is definitely a strong market for it. And i firmly believe it alleviates tensions enough to prevent a lot of assaults
If only there were some way to judge if the pornographization of society had led to more assaults and trafficking 🤔
Very cool to steal the arguments pedophiles use to justify what’s on their hard drives.
Nope. I believe people should carry, or rather deserve, more dignity than that.
What’s your profession and why do you presume there is more dignity in that over sex work?
See how quickly you resort to thinly-veiled insults?
If someone thinks sex work lacks dignity, they clearly have a weird puritanical fixation and they have a lot of growing up to do. Sex workers deserve workers’ rights, same as any other profession.
You clearly don’t even have the attention span to understand what the Nordic Model is lol.
See, he downvotes and moves on without looking up the Nordic model. You can take the redditor out of reddit, but you can’t always take the reddit out of the redditor.
I know an absolute waste of time when I see one
Removed by mod
Always a great question to ask software nerds. Great thread idea dude!
Edit3: improved wording a bit, and added info below; forgot to add this edit
Legalize and regulate.
I share this view with other issues our society faces as well.
Edit: forgot why.
Why:
Sex work as well as drugs will never be outlawed or enforced fully; looking at drugs, it is used as an excuse to jail the working class for slave labor as well as other things when you follow the money.[1]
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.[2]
[1] The Wire - Daniels Follows the Money | 01:34 | https://youtu.be/9PaBt441FBQ ↩︎
[2] https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-13/ ↩︎
